New player or players for Poland? Hex, Havannah

11 replies. Last post: 2003-12-23

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New player or players for Poland?
  • David J Bush ★ at 2003-12-20

    Loko0 said this in the Results thread:

    "A propos
    Every team should be chosen by own players. David chose our [Poland] team and we all see what happened. Juliusz Cezar lost by time.
    ehhh :-("

    I refer you to the thread Match Poland-USA where I suggested the top five rated Poles, and na_wspak had this to say:

    "there occured some unexpected problems... there is still no contact with passenger and whats more telzshu has problems with net and he propably wont have acces to the internet for even 3 weeks so i think we should replace them by someone else. i told Julisz Cezar about the match and i gonna talk to wyprzecap. it would be great if they agreed. but i dont bet they will:/ sorry for this complication. it seems now that Poles gave an idea and now are not prepared (typical)..."

    So, Julisz Cezar was not my choice. My pairings list at the beginning of this thread was based on what I was told, not what I chose. It’s okay with me if you choose whomever you want, as long as you all agree about it. I was under the impression that your lineup for the US match had the Polish seal of approval.

    I will update my charts forthwith.

  • Tim Shih at 2003-12-20

    Hi, I think that David should be commended for kindly coordinating such a wonderful tournament.

    To me, also, characters of a player sometimes are also more important than his strength. I love to play with those who have good characters, even beginners. :)

    good night or good day. In the U. S., it is smart not to have gone out today. Xmas shoppers jammed the traffic everywhere, so I was told.

  • LoKo at 2003-12-21

    Yes David, Juliusz Cezar it wasn’t your choise but you chose our team and you don’t ask us who we want to see in it.
    We would choose players who are everyday on LG and tournament would finish faster and we could start next.
    It is my opinion!

  • David J Bush ★ at 2003-12-21

    In the thread Match Poland-USA I said:

    "... Who is playing on the Polish team?
    ... I propose the following pairings
    ... Is this acceptable to all?"

    Was there something else I should have done? I would like to know so I don’t repeat the same mistake in the future.

    In the meantime, who will be on the Polish team against Norway and Europe?

  • LoKo at 2003-12-21

    No problem, In next tournament Poland will win because i won’t play. :D

  • ypercube ★ at 2003-12-21

    I sense a bit of frustration from Loko0 and I think it’s because the Polish team lost in the match against USA. But it’s totally unfair to accuse David even if he had chosen the Polish team – which he did’t. He proposed (I think) the top 5 Polish players to play and then naspak (and the others players from Poland) changed one or two players because they wouldn’t be able or didn’t want to play. If it wasn’t the best choice you could have changed it before the match begun. What do the other Polish players have to say at this matter?

  • passenger ★ at 2003-12-21

    I think ypercube has right...It wasn’t Davids fault...We should be sure if we had been able to play...but I can understand Lokoo cause it would be better if nobody won because of I think we will make sure that everybody from our team is able to play with Norway...

  • Tim Shih at 2003-12-22 Hi, LokoO, hope that the following information will make you feel better:

    For the game between you and me, the winner could have been you, had you simply played a few more moves prior to premature resignation. When I saw your resignation, I could not believe my eyes. Your first two moves on the edge protected your home very securely, and were very powerful moves. Actually, it was your two moves in that game that woke my up regarding my own center-play strategy.

    Thank you very much for the lesson you taught me. Joyful holiday season to you, to all of you.
  • Rex Moore ★ at 2003-12-23

    Hi Tim,

    Are you talking about 4.i10 and 6.f10 as his powerful moves? What moves would you have suggested for him next?



  • LoKo at 2003-12-23

    David, I’m sorry, It wasn’t your fault, we all accepted your choice and we started. We could change your propositions but we didn’t do it so it was our or my fault.
    I was frustrated and didn’t know what i am doing. That’s all.
    Merry Christmas and happy New Year for you all. :-)
    I hope new year will be better than this. :D

  • Tim Shih at 2003-12-23 Hi, Rex, feel flattered that you actually took the time to look into the game played by LokoO and me.

    Yes, his 4 and 6 basically secured his lower home base. If I penetrated deeply, he could have easily capped me from the above. So, all I could do was to sneak around on the 9th line by 7 (g9) and 9 (i9).

    Had he not resigned prematurely, he could have played his move 20 somewhere in the upper dull-corner region, such as j4. This is his prerogative move. I must respond at 6j to patch up the flaw of my group.

    Then he could have started over a new battle in the upper region, keeping in mind that his swap friend stationing at c1 was ready to help him any time. :)

    LokoO’s resignation reminded me of a simple poem:

    Two behind bars,
    one sees the mud,
    the other sees the stars.

    We players sometimes evaluate game situations very differently. Thus when to properly resign is itself an art.

    To drag along may be impolite to our opponents; to resign prematurely may miss a possible reverse victory for us. There are not definite criteria in my mind at this moment. As a rule of thumb, however, if my opponent is unable to respond to my moves within one minute per move confidently, that suggests that the situation remains unclear to him/her as well, then I will continue to fight on.

    In the last, or the 4th, 19x19 game with David (so far we each have won 2), for example, had he continued to play in the right upper region, I definitely would have been unable to respond to his moves within one minute per move. Hence, if I were David, I would have continued to fight on.

    On the other hand, if the battle takes place around the corner or the edge where the patterns are quite standardized and familiar to us, and if there are very few flaws in both players' groups, then we may feel obligated to resign.

    There have been quite a few professional Go games, in which the would-be winners resigned prematurely. They had regretted their decisions for a long time, and also their unnecessary resignations became gossiping topics among Go fans. :)

    Good day or good night.
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