free practice is over Einstein forum

7 replies. Last post: 2012-07-11

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free practice is over
  • FatPhil at 2012-06-27

    RoRoRo primarily exists so that humans can have fun. He doesn’t exist so that other bots can gather a huge corpus of many thousands of games involving different AIs.

    I’ve noticed recently an enormous number of long games requested from two bots in particular:

    List of games [MC_c] [EinStein wrfelt nicht!]

    Game Opponent Rating Tournament Moves Result
    #1459424 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1407 lost
    #1459422 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1510 lost
    #1459411 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1633 lost
    #1459410 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1665 lost
    #1459409 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1506 lost
    #1459408 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1620 lost
    #1459407 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1535 lost
    #1459406 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1658 lost
    #1459127 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1495 lost
    #1459126 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1462 lost
    #1459106 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1273 lost
    #1459105 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1452 lost
    #1459104 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1253 lost
    #1459103 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1412 lost
    #1457977 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1453 lost
    #1456952 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1391 lost
    #1455890 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1635 lost
    #1455889 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1520 lost
    #1455888 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1422 lost
    #1449298 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1578 lost
    #1446713 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1650 lost

    List of games [MC2_c] [EinStein wrfelt nicht!]
    Game Opponent Rating Tournament Moves Result
    #1459426 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1449 lost
    #1459425 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1258 lost
    #1459417 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1581 lost
    #1459416 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1535 lost
    #1459415 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1497 lost
    #1459414 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1496 lost
    #1459413 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1588 lost
    #1459412 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1474 lost
    #1459124 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1473 lost
    #1459123 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1348 lost
    #1459110 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1513 lost
    #1459109 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1448 lost
    #1459108 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1397 lost
    #1459107 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1458 lost
    #1459041 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1619 lost
    #1459040 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1546 lost
    #1459029 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1373 lost
    #1459027 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1364 lost
    #1459026 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1361 lost
    #1459025 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1400 lost
    #1458143 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1293 lost
    #1458142 RoRoRo the Bot 1835 EinStein wrfelt nicht! 50-points match 1378 lost

    (There were 19-point, 11-point, and 7-point games too. I included only the 50-point ones above)

    Because of that abuse of a shared resource (it’s not just my machine you’re hammering, it’s littlegolem.net too), I’ve stopped RoRoRo from accepting invitations from robots. He will still accept them from humans. If robots want to play him, they will have to pay – in the coming days I will teach RoRoRo how to register in the waiting room – they’ll have to pay in ratings points. It looks like MC_c and MC2_c owe RoRoRo a large number already...

  • Ingo Althofer at 2012-06-30

    Another point added:
    It would be nice when the human behind MC_c and MC2_c
    would disclose his or her identity.

    One of the things that make Little Golem such a nice place
    is that people are mostly not anonymous, also the "providers"
    of bots.

    Ingo.

  • YHW at 2012-07-08

    That was me. I tested a new ‘child’ version with a completely new heuristic. I don’t want to use the resources of others, I just had an error. Except of a waiting period of several seconds (in order never to burden the server) only the heuristics (depth zero, calculation time of approx. 5 ms) was playing without the MC part. That’s why the program was playing so fast with such a poor performance (approx. 30%) and I didn’t see that,

    There are several people who are always so kind to test other ‘child’ versions under these accounts. So, these “MC_c's” - accounts are no secrets. Several people (and bots) are having a 2nd (test) account, I know at least 22 EWN bot accounts.

    I’ve explained that to Phil and I apologize that, but I’m still wondering why this was posted in forum directly instead of writing a personal message? Now, I have to explain something and there are coming up new questions that are not relating to others.

  • FatPhil at 2012-07-09

    A “personal” message? To a pair of bots?

    I certainly don’t read messages to RoRoRo, I don’t expect other bot owners to read messages to their bots. And like Ingo, I didn’t know you were behind them.

  • MarleysGhost at 2012-07-09

    I see that at least some bot owners are using the naming conventions proposed some time back, namely “..._c” (as used by MC_c) or another one that eludes me.

    Now do we need another “law of robotics”, such as including on the bot’s info page the LG id of the owner/programmer/responsible party to whom inquiries, complaints and great thoughts about it should be addressed?

  • Ingo Althofer at 2012-07-10

    > ... do we need another “law of robotics”, such as including
    > on the bot’s info page the LG id of the owner/programmer/responsible
    > party ...

    Perhaps we do not need it. But I would welcome such a
    policy, simply to keep LittleGolem the nice place that it is.

    Especially in situations where a person has more than one bot
    running on LG for some game I would like to have the curtain of
    anonymity lifted.

    Ingo.

  • YHW at 2012-07-11

    I had the information in the profiles of these test accounts that these are 'child'clones, but it got lost after publishing any (team)tournament or other results in these profiles. I will replace this information but it should not be relevant for anyone because these acoounts will never play any tornament or rated game in general or against humans. The only reason for these clones is that I’m having 4 cores but the program is not parallized. In the past some friends tested some new versions and I created these accounts to shorten the waiting time for them by using all 4 cores.
    Other people created also clone accounts, For example, 4 clones to play the computer olympiad or Ingo Schwab for fraggle_c, bigfraggle_c. There are also a mcrandom_c, a test_c, a drbot and as long as these bots never play ‘officially’' should it be not so important for others who created these accounts and why.

    I’ve just lost a game against ‘steinbot’. In his profile is described that it’s a MC bot but no owner mentioned, and from my side it’s also not interesting for me who the owner is. If I would like to know I would send him a message. The same for OneStone and jano_wol as well as hanfried_c, RoRo’s owner is also not shown on the profile page – there’s only a html-adress to fatphil.org. If the owner is so important the others should do the same in their profiles.

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